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what does it mean to be a Mystic?

 
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Georgia B. Cobb



Joined: 09 Mar 2009
Posts: 21
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA

PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 12:45 am    Post subject: what does it mean to be a Mystic? Reply with quote

Dear Sisters,

Rayati all,

Do any of you follow a mystical or contemplative path? If so, do you meditate or chant or whatever?

I feel strongly called to a mystical path, but am confused at times about how to proceed. Some of the traditional Buddhist and Hindu writings I have read on this subject speak of the "annihilation of the ego". Since the "ego" is a Freudian term which I (as a Deanist) reject as having no validity, I do not know what they are talking about. Could any of you explain the purpose of the mystical experience from a Deanic point of view.

May Dea be with you,
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Mengxia Yu
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Joined: 07 Feb 2008
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Location: Arkadya

PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honoured Miss Cobb,

I follow a contemplative path. I meditate and chant daily.

My meditation varies depending on my situation and what issues need my attention. In the morning, I do 108 prostrations with the phrase "Ave Maria, Virgo Fidelis". In the evening, I do 108 prostrations with the phrase "Ave Maria, Mater Misericordia". This comes from St. Louis de Montfort's "True Devotion to Mary". (Although St. Louis only calls for 60-100 prostrations, I find it far more beneficial to do an extra eight and keep track of them on my mala beads than to count every single one and pay more attention to my counting than chanting.)

"Ego" is not meant in the Freudian sense, but the Freudian term is one of the easiest ways to explain "not-self" to Westerners. In a Deanic sense, ego could be considered to be putting oneself before Dea. One must annihilate the temptation to consider oneself first in anything. In doing this, one learns to see Dea in everything--in a cup of tea, in one's neighbour, even in one's garbage can.

I highly recommend prostration as a daily practice for many reasons. The physical lowering of one's body serves as a reminder of not-self. (In fact, if you even try to meditate with your chin raised, you will find that your eyeballs wander inside your eyelids and you cannot concentrate properly.) In bowing, you acknowledge the worthfulness of what you bow to. A bow is the position of absolute trust, because it means leaving yourself vulnerable to whatever you are bowing to. Bowing expresses the Buddhist concept of "lha, nyen, lu", or "heaven, earth, maid". Lha refers to the highest points in the world and the mind; in maid, it relates to the head. Nyen refers to the solid, sturdy points of the world, like mountains, to bravery and friendship; in maid, it relates to the shoulders. Lu refers to the low points of the world, especially water and wet places; in maid, it refers to everything below the waist. By bowing the head, then the upper body, then the lower body, you bring lha, nyen, and lu together, mirroring the harmony and natural progression of the world. It is a declaration of your intention to fit into your proper place in the Golden Order.

if you are new to meditation, I suggest the writings of Honoured Thich Nhat Hanh, especially The Blooming of a Lotus. We have done some of those structured meditations after class at the College, and many can likely attest to their quality. I can elaborate more on meditation if you would like.

For chanting, find a mantra that works well for you. It may take some trial and error. If you have a favourite prayer, you may try a line from it that you find particularly meaningful. As you chant it, turn it over in your mind and consider just what it means--both to you and the grand scheme of things.

The mystical experience...I find that it is a way to deepen one's personal relationship with Dea. (I encourage it in conjunction with Services, not by itself.) It is a way to improve one's relationship with oneself, the world, and with Dea. It can bring so many things, from understanding of scripture to a better night's sleep.

I hope some of that was helpful. I can elaborate on any of it if need be.
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Georgia B. Cobb



Joined: 09 Mar 2009
Posts: 21
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA

PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 2:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honored Miss Mengxia Yu,

Rayati,

Thank you so much for clarifying that "ego" in a Hindu mystical context does not have the same meaning as "ego" in the the Freudian context. If what is meant is not being "selfish", (thinking of oneself "little self" instead of or apart from Dea) but concentrating on the "Greater Self" the reality of Our Mother Dea, then I can understand.

I have heard of prostrating oneself (in prayer) before the Divine, but am not acquaint with the multiple prostrations form of which you speak. I appreciate your explaining the value of bowing ones head and lowering ones body in humility and trust.

My usual form of meditation is singing. I listen to songs or chants on tapes or videos which are dedicated to God The Mother, and sing along. Lisa Theal wrote a beautiful song called The Mother of All Things which I find very inspirational. Recently, I committed to memory the Italian words to one of the more familiar forms of the Ave Maria prayer. This has been my solace in many situations lately when I have been troubled and needed guidance.

Yes, please do tell me more about your understanding of mystical or contemplative path and practices.

Dea bless you,

Miss Georgia B. Cobb
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Chancandre Aquitaine



Joined: 18 Feb 2008
Posts: 63
Location: Nevrayapurh, Novarya

PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Herr Doktor Freud's use of "ego" is actually the employment, in a particular jargon-sense, of a much older term - in fact one of the oldest terms in the Indo-European languages. In German it is spelled "ich" and in English it was ic, though it later dropped the guttural and became simply "I".

In Eastern Tellurian doctrines, terms like "I" or "self", used in spiritual contexts, can have one of two opposite meanings - the "ego" which is the greatest barrier, or the Spirit Herself - the Atma or Supreme Self within all beings and transcending them.

The term "ego" in this context has a very precise equivalent in Déanic usage. We speak of it as the false self, as opposed to the true Self, which is ultimately the Atma, but "microcosmically" the individual self in devotion to Dea.

Chanting the Names of Dea is said to be the surest and simplest way in this Kali Yuga, so it is certainly highly recommended.

As to the Ave Maria, the Christian version is thealogically untenable for a Déanist as it very clearly implies, in several places, the non-Divinity of Our Lady. The Filianic "translation" of this prayer is as follows:

Hail Mary, Fount of grace,
Lady of earth and heaven,
Blessed art thou by all maidens,
And blessed is thy most beloved Daughter.
Holy Mary, Mother and God,
Shelter us fallen ones
Now and in the hour of our death.
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Georgia B. Cobb



Joined: 09 Mar 2009
Posts: 21
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA

PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honored Raya Chancandre Aquitaine,

Rayati,

I am beginning to understand a little bit better the meaning of "true self" and "false self". From what I have read about Dr. Freud, I gather that he was an atheist and materialist and attributed all the processes of the soul to physical, chemical reactions. It was in this sense that I rejected the basis of modern psychology. The terms he used may have come from older, traditional understandings. However, his explanations of Id, Ego and Super Ego are confusing (and not spiritual). The Hawaiian Huna Faith speaks of the lower self, the middle self and the higher self. The Huna Wise Woman whom I heard lecture explained these terms in a spiritual way that made much more sense.

As for the Ave Maria prayer, rest assured that I do not translate it in the Christian doctrinal way. I also replace "Dominus" with "Domina" and "Iesus" with "Inanna".

May Dea be with you,

Miss Georgia B. Cobb
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Chancandre Aquitaine



Joined: 18 Feb 2008
Posts: 63
Location: Nevrayapurh, Novarya

PostPosted: Wed Apr 08, 2009 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I absolutely agree about Dr. Freud - you are quite right - indeed "Freudianism" and all that followed it (including the "anti Freudian" schools) represent the re-writing of maid's conception of herself in the light of the Pseudomythos and the Animal Thesis.

Freud's division of the (false) self into Ego, Superego and Id is irrelevant to the traditional meaning of Ego, since all three parts are Ego (false self) in the traditional sense. The fundament of Freud's philosophy is to deny, or at best ignore, which in a schematic is tantamount to denying, maid's transcendent aspect. This, of course is part and parcel of the Animal Thesis.

"Psychology", in the traditional sense, is predicated on the distinction between true and false self - atma and jiva, pneuma and psyche, or (with Spirit masculinized by the Romans) Spiritus and Anima. And again, the Jungian jargon-use of the term "anima" is as irrelevant and misleading as Freud's jargon-use of the term "ego".

All these are ultimately predicated on the Animal Thesis and the idea that the mind is ultimately a mere by product of the body with no superior element (though tellingly, Jung acknowledges a horizontal, or "democratic", collective element - though even this is not a question of mind transcending body, but is explained in terms of "evolutionary biology").

The tripartite division of maid is, of course traditional, and Freud gains a certain "intuitive consent" from the mind of maid by mimicking it with his animal-thesis parody.

The Huna philosophy is very likely to be an iteration, within a particular spiritual oeconomy, of the fundamental truth found in all authentic cultures. Although mixing-and-matching from different cultures without a very firm grip of the underlying principles can be misleading.

The following passage from The Clew of the Horse (found in The Gospel of Our Mother God) gives the doctrine in a purely Déanic context. Body and mind are separate entities, although they have a temporary relationship, and neither is the True Self, or Spirit. The two selves here, are represented in the traditional image of the two birds in a tree; and the way of contemplation (with which this conversation began) is explained within the Déanic context.

Quote:
47. Thou art not thy body, nor is thy body any portion of thee. 48. It is an estate which thou hold’st for a time, and after a time shall pass from thee. 49. Therefore, have thou governance of thy body, nor let it be in any thing thy ruler. 50. Keep it in purity as a temple built of earth and a place of devotion.

51. Thou art not thy mind, nor is thy mind any portion of thee. 52. It is an estate which thou hold’st for a time, and after a time shall pass from thee. 53. For longer than the body shalt thou hold it; and when the body passeth into dust, still it shall be with thee. 54. Yet in its turn shall it pass away, and in its appointed season. 55. But thou shalt never pass away; when all the worlds are dust thou shalt endure.

56. Therefore, have thou governance of thy mind, nor let it be in any thing thy ruler. 57. Keep it in purity as a temple built of air and a place of devotion.

58. Hard to govern is the mind, like to a proud horse that drinketh the wind, filled with its own desires. 59. Fain would it draw the rein from thy hand and carry you where it will; fain would it take the body for its mistress. 60. Like to a bird that doth hop from twig to twig, turning first to one fruit, then to another, without control or constancy.

61. Yet calm the mind and bring it to the garden of thy Lady; to the peaceful garden to rest by gentle streams. 62. By long training is it brought to contemplation; is it bridled that it may tread the heavens.

63. Let it be in harmony in all things. In the smallest actions, let its steps be measured. 64. Let the body obey her in her harmony, that all works show forth control, respect and courtesy. 65. As in a dance, the two shall act together, as in a dance where each doth know her part. 66. For if thy horse run loose upon the high-road, how shalt thou learn to ride among the stars?


The Clew of the Horse, from The Gospel of Our Mother God.
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And the rays that blest the golden West
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Georgia B. Cobb



Joined: 09 Mar 2009
Posts: 21
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA

PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2009 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honored Raya Chancandre Aquitaine,

Rayati,

Thank you so much for your explanations. Let me see if I have the relationships straight now. Dr. Freud's Ego, Id, and Superego are all part of the mind (psyche). The false-self (jiva) includes both the body (soma) and the mind (psyche). Another word for the psyche is the soul. The true-self (atma) is the spirit (pneuma). Another word for spirit is anima. The true-self or spirit (atma) of maid is a fragment of The True Self or The Spirit (Atma), Our Mother. The body and the soul of maid are like outer (visible) and inner (hidden) garments of the spirit of maid. Also, the psyche would be the lunar "mental' faculties of maid and the spirit would be solar "intellectual" faculties of maid.

Concerning the three selves of the Hawaiian Huna Tradition, it is possible that they correspond to the physical nature (bodily urges), the soul nature (mental faculties), and the spiritual nature (intellectual faculties). Also, I think I remember the Huna wise woman referring to the "higher-self" as ones "true-self".

Thank you for including the passage from The Clue of The Horse. I had read it before with some intuitive understanding, but also with a little mental confusion. Now that the different terms used have been explained it makes perfect sense.

So, would it me accurate to say tha a mystic would be a maid who through the communion of her true-self (spirit) with The Truth (Spirit) is trained to become the mistress of her false-self (mind and body)?

Sacred Chants to the Mother which fill the mind and engage the bodily vocal cords would be a form of communion.

Would the vekhelic arts of Tai Chi Qi Gong and Svarupa Yoga also be recommended forms of quieting the mind, disciplining the body and strengthening spiritual communion?

I look forward to hearing any comments and suggestions.

May Dea be with you,

Miss Georgia B. Cobb
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Sakura



Joined: 10 Apr 2008
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 11:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was interested in the words of the Filianic Hail Mary. I use it every day and it is beautifully conceived to accord to our Filianic thealogy.

I would really like to see a line-by-line commentary showing the thealogical significance of each of the changes from the Christian version.

Well I know this sounds a bit like saying "Oh would you care to build me a small village this morning" but I think it really might be helpful to other girls too. And it is a quite small village!
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White Roses



Joined: 07 Feb 2008
Posts: 42

PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No sooner said than done!

Your suggestion was such a sensible one that the nice pettes at the Chapel of Our Mother God built you a village:

The Hail Mary Prayer of Our Mother God
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Mengxia Yu
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Joined: 07 Feb 2008
Posts: 435
Location: Arkadya

PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I do apologize for taking so long to write this, Miss Cobb. Things have been quite busy this past week or so, as I am home visiting my Tellurian family and Easter is the high point of the year for Catholics.

Physically, the multiple prostrations go like this:
1. Kneel, with your bottom resting on your heels. If you turn your toes inward, it will help keep your feet from falling asleep as quickly. Rest your hands on your thighs.
2. Place your hands on the floor in front of you, left hand first.
3. Lean forward until your forehead touches the floor between your hands. Breathe out as you do this.
4. Remain in this position as you say your mantra, either out loud or in your head.
5. Straighten up and return your hands to your thighs. Breathe in as you do this.
6. Repeat from step two.

A more strenuous version of this is to stand up between prostrations, but this is for more formal occasions, and one does not usually do more than ten or so in a row. I do not recommend them for daily practice unless you are a monk, as they are physically very demanding. (Your back and arms may become a little bit sore even from the regular prostrations.)

During the prostrations, you should be very present in the act of lowering yourself before the altar. Consider the meaning of your mantra the entire time. It is a way to express your dedication with your body as well as with your mind.

I believe that the meditational Vikhelic Arts you have mentioned would be quite appropriate. I used to do (I fear I have not been well enough to keep up with it) Ip Sun, which is a Korean moving meditation similar to Tai Chi. They are fantastic for the body and mind. It may not seem that you are doing much physically, but you do a lot of energy-moving, so do not feel ashamed if you are tired after practice! You should be tired.
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Georgia B. Cobb



Joined: 09 Mar 2009
Posts: 21
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA

PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear Miss Mengxia Yu,

Rayati,

I quite understand how busy one can be during this season of the year.

Thank you for explaining how you perform the prostrations. I had wondered whether you commenced from a standing or kneeling position.

I was taught an 18 movement Tai Chi Qi Gong moving meditation by Dr. Li Hua, (Dr. of Chinese Medicine). One persorms the 1st movement 3 to 5 times, then the 2nd movement and so forth. Each movement naturally flows into the next. One breathes in and out as one changes positions. Sometimes I practice indoors accompanied by music. Sometimes I practice out of doors accompanied by bird song or rustling wind, or babbling brook. As my brain concentrates on each movement, my mind reaches another level of conciousness. I go through the whole meditation one to three times. I feel both exhausted and refreshed at the end of the meditation.

May Dea be with you,

Miss Georgia Cobb
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Georgia B. Cobb



Joined: 09 Mar 2009
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dear White Roses,

Rayati,

Thank you so much for the line by line explanation of the Aristasian and Christian versions of the Ave Maria prayer. I had read the Aristasian version before, but had not quite understood the reasons for the changes. Now I am in complete agreement with the Aristasian wording. I shall use this prayer in my meditations from now on.

May Dea be with you,

Miss Georgia B. Cobb
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White Roses



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PostPosted: Wed Apr 15, 2009 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We now have a commentary on the line "Hail Mary full of grace/Fount of grace" with an interesting comparison of the Christian representation of Our Lady to that of Kuan Yin:

You may read it here
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